How to Get the VA Benefits You Actually Earned

[0:00] Is it veterans, veterans, veterinarians? What are some areas where the system breaks down and like what can we do to improve that? Yeah, we need to take care of the people that took care of us. So, we got them 100%. And it went back to 2019, which I think yielded about $375,000 in back pay. Jeez. Okay. Today’s guest helps veterans get benefits that they’ve already earned, which sounds really simple until you remember it’s the government. So basically he’s a translator for a system built entirely on

[0:30] acronyms and frustration. Yeah, pretty much. So if the VA had an escape room, Kyle would be the guy who gets you out and then he explains the riddle to you afterwards. Perfect. I’ve seen those forms and I’d rather do burpees. Okay. What happens when a chiropractor and a physical therapist get together to make a health and wellness podcast? But chiropractors and physical therapists don’t like each other. Oh, think again. I’m Kathy Lynch, physical therapist who likes to help people move and get stronger. I’m Dr. Jason Young, an evidence-based chiropractor who uses humor just as much as adjustments to

[1:01] help people get better. Welcome to the PTCH Podcast. Remember, there’s no I in PTCH. All right, welcome back everybody. Today our guest is Kyle Hatch. I’m super excited to have you here, Kyle. Thank you. He has a background as a veteran and he also advocates for veterans. He’s helped a lot of my patients when they’ve needed help with all their VA stuff. I thought of a nice polite way to refer to it. Yes. Yeah. Their stuff. So, thank

[1:32] you so much, Kyle, for being here with us today. So, today we’re going to be kind of shining a light, shedding some light and giving some information about veterans benefits and yeah, we just really appreciate you being here with us, Kyle. So, just tell us, you know, what your experience was when you were leaving the military. Sure. I think like most veterans, I had a difficult time getting out. I got out and went straight into college. I was at LB and Oregon

[2:03] State doing the dual enrolled program and go Beavers and Road Runners. Go Bees. Yeah. And I recognized that there were three things I lost as soon as I got out. I lost that sense of purpose. I lost that sense of camaraderie and that sense of identity and with that I had to find it and it was really really tough. Okay, man. That sounds hard because I don’t know. I can’t imagine the military is fun all the time. But when you’re struggling through stuff, you do build like

[2:33] purpose, camaraderie, you’re struggling with other people and you build really strong bonds. Yeah. Structure, I imagine. Great structure. Yes. So, what did you do then? Like how’d you find it? How’d you find your new purpose. Like how’d you make the new Kyle? That was tough. So when I was doing the dual enroll program, we created a lot of veteran groups. We had a um an event where we were — what was it? It was Team Shower

[3:05] Shoe. So, shower shoes, a military term, and we did this. I got ideas here. And I’m like, wait a minute. This is a family show, Kyle. Oh, sorry. Sorry. No. What is shower shoe? Shower shoes are just sandals that you wear in the shower. Okay, you have to in all military settings, but with that we were Team Shower Shoe and we did a number of different events where we raised money and tried to help out others

[3:37] and we kind of built upon that sense of identity, purpose and camaraderie and while we may have stumbled with the others, I think camaraderie was pretty — Oh man, that’s good. So then tell us a little bit about like so you’ve used the VA system yourself then as a veteran. I have. Okay. What’s your experience been like with that? I’ve had great experiences. I’ve had the same primary care provider since 2008. It

[4:09] was recently changed. Was it two months ago? I got a call that he retired. So wow. I got a call from the VA saying, “Hey, you have a new doctor.” And unfortunately, I think last week I got a call saying, “Hey, that doctor’s left.” So, now I get to meet somebody completely different. But, otherwise it’s been wonderful. Where do you have to go to see your primary? My primary is down in Eugene. Eugene. Okay. So, Eugene’s just an extension of the Roseburg. Okay. So, that’s

[4:40] convenient at least. Can you explain how those systems kind of work? Like the regionality of it, because if you don’t know, Eugene’s like 45 minutes from here it is, and then there’s another VA that’s up in Portland and those are both VA but they’re two separate systems. Yeah, true. And here in Oregon we actually have three. So you have White City which is kind of a standalone. They do a lot of substance abuse. So they do offer primary care and specialty care but they’re very small. Then you have Roseburg and you have

[5:10] that of Portland. So when you think of Portland, at least for our communities, you have the — I guess the extension of Lincoln City and Newport. You also have that of Salem for Portland. And then for I guess Roseburg, you have Eugene, which is the closest to us. And before there really wasn’t a line in the sand. It was gray depending upon who you spoke with. And with some of the changes that have happened through legislation,

[5:42] the pot of money went from a national pot of money to — hey Portland, you have a certain amount of money, Roseburg, you have a certain amount of money. So in that they’ve made it so that anything north of Lane County, so Lane County northward is all Portland and that of Lane County southward is — got cool. How did you find yourself in this position at Samaritan? That’s a tough one. So, I actually finished at Oregon State. Didn’t know what I was going to do with

[6:12] my life and I started working as a medical assistant in primary care. Oh, cool. And with that, I quickly escalated into being the back office supervisor, safety officer, and there was an opportunity where I was able to go to a football game. Go Bees. And with that I met Larry Mullins, who I learned was a Marine, and we got to talking about how at that point, Veterans Choice came out, how there were a lot of problems with veterans

[6:43] understanding how to work that system. There were a lot of problems with the VA knowing how to use that program. And then, of course, us at Samaritan, we had no idea what we were doing, and we wanted to better that for veterans and for ourselves. So, can we pause for a second? Yeah. Because I know there’s probably a lot of people that are wondering what Veterans Choice is. I said it weird. Veterans, right? Is it veterans? Veterans. Veterinarians. It’s not veterinarians. Definitely not. Not the last one. No, it’s veterans. So, this is how

[7:14] I was first introduced to it because I didn’t believe it. So, I’ve been working with veterans for probably — gosh, it’s maybe a dozen years now. And the first guy who came in with it — he was kind of a scary-looking dude, probably. So if he’s listening to this, which he probably won’t, let’s be honest. He probably remembers this, because he came in. He’s like, “Yeah, I’m a veteran and you know they’re going to pay for my chiropractic care.” And I’m like, “Well, no, they’re not.

[7:45] I know enough about our government that they’re not going to pay.” He’s like, “No, no, no. They seriously are.” He’s like, “Look, here’s this authorization. It says all the things you can do.” And I’m looking at it, I’m like, “Well, this looks legit, but yeah, I’m just going to go with my gut here. They’re not going to pay for it.” But he talked me into it. And sure enough, they paid, and I was like, “Oh my gosh.” And he started referring more and more people. And so now I’ve treated hundreds of veterans and it’s been really rewarding. But for people listening, explain what this program is with Veterans Choice. Yeah.

[8:16] So, Veterans Choice is a program that started under the Obama administration back in 2014. And it was created because a lot of veterans unfortunately had really limited access to care, and there were a number of veterans in Arizona specifically who were taking their lives in the parking lots of emergency rooms. And that led to the media getting involved and Obama having to make some big changes. So he quickly created the Veterans Choice Program, which allowed

[8:47] veterans who were waiting for appointments in the VA system to get care in the community. So when you say in the parking lot, you’re talking about the parking lot of like VA hospitals? Jeez. Well, and I remember when I was in chiropractic school, we would go to Washington DC to lobby. And one of the things that we’d talk about every time was that there was legislation that said that every active duty military member, every veteran was supposed to have access to chiropractic care. And the way that they were doing that was — there are

[9:17] these regions, and they’re numbered. I can’t remember how many there are. You probably know, but they’re numbered. And so for our region in Oregon, if you needed to see the chiropractor, you could definitely go see them in Boise, Idaho. So you had a treatment plan where you had to get treated, you know, three or four times. That’s three or four trips. And if you’re active duty military — oh yeah, you’re definitely going to get the leave to go to Boise, right?

[9:47] So essentially, people weren’t getting the care. But this program changed everything, and it’s been pretty awesome. Yeah. Well, compared to having to go to Boise. No, it’s definitely opened the doors. And the program that was originally Veterans Choice changed in 2019 to the Mission Act. And what was nice with that is the Trump administration worked with a lot of veteran service organizations to try and figure out how to improve that

[10:17] program. What they did is they really opened the doors. So, what used to be where veterans had to look at whether or not they resided within 40 miles from the nearest VA — not where they’d get care, but the nearest VA — it now made it so that there were differences in that if a veteran needed to get primary care or mental health treatment, now if you need an appointment, you look at 30 minutes of an average drive time, or if the VA can get you in within 20 days. Or for specialty care, can you get

[10:48] an appointment within 28 days or 60 minutes of an average drive time? So it really opened it up for veterans. I see. I didn’t even know that. Learned that today. Okay. Yeah. That’s pretty amazing. Awesome. Yeah. So, one of the things when we asked you to be on the podcast — one of the things that you talked about was veterans not using their benefits, or not knowing that they had the benefits. Tell us more about that, and kind of in your work, what you do to help those people

[11:18] out. Sure. So, what I’ve learned with other veteran advocates across our county — in Oregon — is that there’s a number of veterans who aren’t using benefits. And if you look at the national numbers, I think the national numbers show something to the effect of 50% of veterans aren’t using any benefits. And if you look at the Oregon numbers, we’re worse off in that only 40% of veterans are actually using the benefits. And that is sad because there are a lot of benefits that

[11:48] they are certainly entitled to that they’re not using. And those benefits range from VA service-connected disability, which opens up doors for other benefits, VA healthcare — there’s a new program that was created through some of the Oregon state legislature, which is through the Oregon Health Plan. So dental used to be a really tough one. If you wanted dental, you had to be 100% service connected, which is a hard feat. Yeah. And with that — so does that mean 100% service connected means you have to have a disability that impacts your

[12:18] employability? Got it. 100%. Okay. So with that, if you were 100% you could get free dental, among other things. But with this new Oregon Health Plan Veterans Dental Program, if you meet other criteria — I think it’s $60-some thousand — if you make under that, you get free dental. And that’s a big one. Yeah, that’s huge. Dental has a lot of implications, as you know, for other health. And that’s certainly a benefit they’re entitled to, but there’s a number of other

[12:49] things, like aid and attendance. If somebody needs assistance with their activities of daily living, there’s money, and I help in all of these arenas. That’s great. Wow. Yeah. What would you say are some of the misconceptions veterans have about what they’re eligible for? Misconceptions. I think when you look at healthcare, people think a few different things. They may think that VA healthcare is subpar, and in reality I think that the VA exceeds many of the private

[13:21] sector providers in a lot of ways, because they have some money and they’re able to work with wonderful places like OSU and others to stay on top of some of the cutting-edge medical treatments that are out there. I would also say that some veterans think that they can’t get into VA healthcare because they’re not service connected, or people think, “Well, I’m not a veteran because I actually didn’t serve in combat,” and there’s some misunderstanding there. So that’s a big one. Maybe that person has like an administrative role or something, like

[13:51] that. Sure. But I never left the United States, and because of that I didn’t deserve to be a veteran. And there’s a lot — still a veteran though. You’re a veteran. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. But it’s sad that a lot of people don’t really understand the true definitions and the eligibility requirements that are required to actually get the care that is eligible. Well, I have some strong feelings about that because I know I’ve had patients who that’s the situation. They’re like, “Oh, yeah. I was a logistics clerk, and so — I didn’t really get injur — I sat at a desk.

[14:22] Maybe I got carpal tunnel or something like that.” And I think that for me, like, I really love working with the veterans. And part of it is because I’m really grateful to be an American. I’m grateful to be in a situation where I can own a business. I have so many choices. I can take care of my family, and, you know, God bless America. Can we get like some patriotic music played over this or something like that? Is that a thing? We’ll get it in post. But the

[14:54] thing that I explain to people whenever they say that to me is like, look, I’ve never had a day in my life where somebody told me that they were going to put a gun in my hand and tell me where I had to go stand and that there might be people shooting at me. And maybe that didn’t happen to them, but that’s what they signed up for. That’s the possibility at the end of the day — soldier, sailor, you know, guardian. Did you

[15:24] know that’s what it is for Space Force? That’s so cool. Guardians of the Galaxy. Guardian, right? Exactly. Guardian of the planet. But I think that that’s something that’s special because I benefit from that, right? I benefit from somebody putting themselves in a situation where they could be asked to sacrifice it all. Right. And so I feel like we have a social contract. We have a responsibility to take very good care of veterans because they already gave, right? They already paid.

[15:55] So they did. Yeah. Yeah. Do you see many veterans in your practice? Yeah, we do. Yeah. You guys do the community care. Okay, cool. Yep. TriWest. Mhm. The third-party billing. Yes. Mhm. Yep. Awesome. Yeah. So we take those insurances for sure. Yeah. So, where — what are some areas where the system breaks down and like what can we do to improve that? So, I think that one of the biggest is

[16:26] it’s a bureaucracy, and it takes veterans a lot to get through some of the bureaucratic crap that’s out there when it comes to some of these benefits. Yeah. The VA is supposed to be there for us and take what we say, you know, hopefully for granted, and not kick it back. And I would say more times than not, you get a veteran who — maybe they were a Marine who served in Iraq — and one of my guys, for

[16:58] instance, he was over in Fallujah, one of the worst battles since Hue City, Vietnam, door to door. And he got out after getting shot and fragged and lost 5 cm of his femur. And the VA gave him 30%. That was his 30% service-connected disability rating. Wow. And it’s unfortunate because the VA — they need like another 10 millimeters of femur or something like that. Oh my god.

[17:29] Wow. Oh, well, I don’t think that they’re really looking at some of the implications of having such an injury. You know, obviously something like that is going to cause gait instability, which is going to cause other issues. And none of that was looked at. And I think how is the system broke? It’s broke because they don’t actually look at the full picture. And when veterans apply for things, I think more times than not, they’re actually denied and they have to apply again and again and again. And this non-adversarial system is grossly

[18:00] adversarial. Yeah. And that’s unfortunate. So that would be one of many, many ways that the system is broken, and that’s something that you help veterans with. I do. Yeah. So help me understand your role — you’re an advocate for veterans within the system, or like what do you do? I know that you’re — people come to you all the time, like, “Yes, Kyle’s helping me out with this,” and everything like that, but what is your role there? I guess. So, I wear many hats. So, I’m employed by

[18:32] Samaritan, and I started the role with Larry where I was a navigator. So I help veterans get to whatever benefit that they may need, whether that be employment, whether that be education. If they were homeless and they needed some assistance there, I helped them with that. If they needed help with veterans choice, that’s what I did. Okay. What we found is that there was a big issue when it came to disability benefits. Okay. So I got the study material and I started my efforts in

[19:02] learning veterans law, and I took a test and got accredited as a VA agent with the Office of General Counsel with the VA, and now I prepare and present claims before the VA and argue cases all the way up into the Board of Veterans Appeals. Okay. All right. That is cool. Never thought in a million years I’d love law. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Wow. So that’s like as close as you can come to being a lawyer without actually being a lawyer. The

[19:33] shame of a lawyer. I mean, yes. Call yourself a lawyer. You know what I love is my daughter’s going to go to law school, right? And she’s going to hear you say that. She is. And I’m going to be like, “Yeah, you know, she’s right. I love you, too. Taylor, you’re my favorite.” Well, and we say that because like one day we might need somebody to bail us out. She’s definitely going to have to be the one. She’s kind of a pitbull. Yeah. Wow, that’s pretty cool. Yeah. Well, tell us some success

[20:04] stories. I mean, like give us — don’t reveal anybody’s identity or anything like that, but give us some examples of maybe times that you’ve been able to help out, or times when you’ve really seen the VA step up and show up for a patient or a veteran. Sure. So, one that comes to mind, I think, more than not, is I had a veteran — Vietnam veteran, boots on the ground, three deployments — was a Marine infantryman, and he

[20:35] wasn’t service-connected. He was receiving a VA pension. And a VA pension is for those lower-income veterans who served during wartime that make under the national poverty line. And what the VA does is they’ll either give you that amount of money or they’ll give you the difference based upon how much you get in social security. And he got some money from the VA for that. And he got a letter saying we’re going to take this away because now your social security is far above that of the national poverty line and now you’re not

[21:05] going to receive this benefit. Oh jeez. So we started looking at the situation and this guy had died — I think on the table three times. He had a number of cardiovascular health issues and what we found is, oh, there’s a lot more for him to explore. And what was great is we were able to kind of look at his service treatment record. We were able to look at his medical history and find a number of things. We got him 100% and it

[21:35] went back to 2019, which I think yielded about $375,000 in back pay. Geez. Okay. So that certainly was a positive. I have one right now where the VA did something also similar and they didn’t follow through on something. And this one’s going to go back to 1986 for a VAT. We’re just waiting for the argument at the board. Wow. So that’s 1.4 mil. Whoa. Yes. Whoa. That’s huge. That’s gonna make a huge difference — it’s like

[22:07] that’s generational. Yeah. I’m struggling to stay at the poverty line and it’s like, well, we should have been paying you all this all along. Way more. Let’s see. Is that taxable? No. Oh my gosh. Oh, that’s huge. Oh man, you are doing the Lord’s work. I think the biggest thing is you’re giving people the validation for all the things that they’ve been experiencing and that’s huge. Yeah. The validation is just as important. But you’re holding people accountable. I mean, you’re holding the

[22:37] VA accountable for the fact that if we didn’t go overseas and do these things, we wouldn’t come back with the ailments that we have, right? Well, and I don’t think the VA are the bad guys, you know? Because I think — and I’m not trying to make excuses for them, because sometimes it’s like, guys, this is really stupid — but from my perspective I think that they have a ton of people that they’re trying to serve and it’s an incredibly complex job, because we don’t even

[23:07] understand all the injuries that people receive. The service-connected injuries. Did I use the terminology correctly? Okay. Yeah. We don’t understand those injuries and we’re learning more and more about them. Like, we didn’t understand things like PTSD. And actually I just saw a study on the effect of concussions on the brain — specifically concussions from explosions — and I don’t think that we appreciated before that if you are in

[23:37] an area where there’s an explosion, it radically changes the balance of gray matter and white matter in your brain. That’s irreversible, and you might not show any signs of that, but you have had a physical change to your brain. Absolutely. And so just incredibly complex things, and it’s new things all the time. And so I can appreciate that what they’re doing is so complex, but it’s also so important. And it’s great that there are advocates like you, because I can

[24:09] imagine it’s also really — it’s got to be devastating — it’s like, yes, I know what I lost, and how much that hurt, and it’s got to hurt to be like, my country isn’t showing up for me. I showed up for them. Yes. Yes. I did what I was supposed to do and I did not choose to feel like this and this is the rest of my life. And so it makes sense that people would be taking drastic steps like suicide in a parking lot, which I hope nobody ever feels like

[24:39] they need to do. Gosh. Yeah. Absolutely. And I would say, well, first shout out to my friend in Buffalo, Stacy, who’s a PA at the VA in Buffalo. So I know they have really good healthcare providers there. She’s top-notch. Let’s go, Stace. Yes. Let’s go. But also the providers I do work with, with my patients — they’re some of the most responsive physicians I have. I’ll send notes and I’ll send my note over to them and next thing you know my patient gets

[25:10] a test for what I suggested they need a test for. So yeah. Yeah. I’ve found that at least my communication with the VA has been great and I feel like I’m on a team with them in helping care for the patients. So yeah. No, I think that they really do care. There’s a number of wonderful people there. They’re just inundated. Absolutely. And that’s the toughest. They’re overwhelmed. Yeah. And you know, when you look at the budgetary things that we do, I really wish — I

[25:41] mean, the budget just went up for military again, which, you know, I’m all about supporting those people, but just because it’s gone up for the military does not mean that it’s gone up for the VA. What’s that? It has. Oh, it has. Okay, that’s good. Unfortunately, it has. But unfortunately, at the same time, I think they’re cutting VHA employees. So Veterans Health Administration employees by 80,000 — 80,000 jobs. 80,000 jobs. That’s — but hopefully something changes.

[26:13] Yeah, I really — it’s not a permanent thing. Agreed. I think Secretary Collins, Deputy Secretary Lawrence, they’re solid. I mean, I’ve seen them in their prior roles. They’re veterans themselves and they’re, in my opinion, very pro-veteran for all the stuff that they did before they got into these roles and I hope that that continues. Yeah. So yeah. And it’s a big job. I mean, the US military is a big job. I think we take it for granted because all of our lives the country’s had a professional

[26:44] military. Not every country has that. No. Right. And it’s — some people love this, some people hate this — but it’s really the military for the world. We police conflicts in other places and so it’s a huge responsibility, not just to keep us safe, but to keep some bad, bad people all over the world at bay. So — so are you comparing deployments to Iraq to a Super Bowl?

[27:14] Sort of no. Professional sports. Yes. Exactly. Yeah. But they are professionals, you know. Yeah. I think that the people that I’ve had the chance to interact and interface with — I think they’re heroes, right? And I don’t mean that in some sort of kitschy type of way, but right. Yeah. We need to take care of the people that took care of us. Right. We really

[27:46] do. Some of them are jerks. Some are just real jerks, but it’s like, you’re a jerk who gave. And so we owe you respect. Signed up for things that we — They’re people. They’re people, right? Oh my goodness. Well, let’s see. We got a few minutes left here. Oh, there was one quick question that I told a veteran that I was going to ask you. Sure. And the question was about getting authorization — what they noticed was that when they had a specific provider

[28:16] in mind that it was easier to get authorization from the VA for the care that they wanted. Do you agree with that? Is that something that you would advise people to do, or is it pretty much equivocal? I would say it really depends. So, first and foremost, the question to ask is does that provider take on VA community care? If they do, wonderful. The veteran can also take proactive steps where they get the appointment ahead of time, and that time

[28:47] when the primary care team sets forth the referral, when that team calls from the office of community care to figure out what the preferences are — because usually once an authorization’s done, they call the veteran, they say, you know, do you want a female or male? What time of day do you want your first appointment? So that they can schedule that. If they’ve already gone ahead and scheduled that far enough in advance so that the authorization has time to go through its process, yes, that’s going to be a lot better, because when they call for those preferences

[29:17] they could just finalize the authorization by simply saying, “Hey, I have an appointment with Dr. Young at Body of Health at such and such time at such and such date,” and that will finalize it all and nothing more will need to be done. Otherwise you’ll prolong it. Yeah. Another few weeks. Yeah. And Body of Health, you could be a sponsor. Wait. Oh, hold on. You already are sponsoring. Jeez, I just get used to that now. Well, cool. Is there anything else that you feel like — I mean, because

[29:49] this is your platform for a little bit — is there a message that you feel like veterans need to know, or maybe even just the civilians need to know, to kind of appreciate the situation and what you’re doing? Sure. So the things that I would say essentially is veterans should never walk alone in this, especially working through this bureaucratic VA. I think that it means well, as we’ve talked about, but it is very, very tough and the legalese throughout that is daunting. So with

[30:22] that, veterans also carry weight that others won’t typically understand, and with that they carry it in a way that usually comes in the form of trauma, but it’s not seen. So one thing to recognize — if you are the veteran, reach out. Reach out to an organization that may help you through this. LinkUp Vets is a local one out of Lebanon. You have Team Semper, you have the Wounded Warrior Program. All

[30:52] of these organizations do amazing things. And I would say — give me the contact info and I’ll put it in the show notes so people can click on that. Yeah, that would be good. But all of those organizations are great in that they help veterans get out and they build on that sense of purpose, identity, and camaraderie that I talked about before. Veterans need to understand that they also need to reach out and connect with their accredited representatives. So whether that be a veteran service officer with a veteran service

[31:22] organization, an accredited agent or accredited attorney, they need to know what benefits they have and have somebody walk them through those steps. The big thing veterans should recognize is the fact that there are good people with good intentions who actually know how to help them through this maze, and they just need to go seeking out that help, right? If you’re a spouse, partner, or friend, remember that you matter. That you are often the individuals who are noticing that somebody — a veteran — is dealing with the issues that they are, because us

[31:53] veterans are going to not recognize the problems that we’re compartmentalizing and not really looking at. More times than not, it is the loved one that says, “Hey, hey, bud. We need to go talk to someone.” Yeah. And I would urge that loved one to go stand up and help that veteran to that next step, whether that be a service organization or a healthcare provider who can actually help. If you’re a

[32:24] healthcare provider, I would say it’s important. I’m a healthcare provider. Okay. Me too. Listen up. Listen back. I’m paying attention. So you all play a critical role in this journey for veterans. The VA is going to look at your documentation. They’re going to make sure that you articulate certain things that may have huge implications for a veteran who may be seeking service connection. It’s going to come back down to your documentation. So I would say please make sure that you listen to the veteran, but at the same

[32:54] time, I think it’s also important for providers to understand what’s going on with veterans these days. So knowing what implications there are for toxicity with radioactive material, with Vietnam veterans who were exposed to herbicides, burn pits, or blast injuries as you talked about. There’s a lot of issues that can start small but also grow into something big. I would say if you’re a veteran, know this.

[33:24] You’ve earned these benefits. They’re not a handout. Mhm. That’s right. Amen. Even if you’re doing well. Yes. Because sometimes I see that with people like, “Oh, I’ve got a good job and I can afford this and everything like that, so I don’t need it.” Yeah. It’s like, but we want to give it to you because you earned it, right? Yes. And with that, I think the big thing is you’re entitled to it. And if you’re looking at the right benefits, they have huge implications for your families as well. Yes. So if you don’t care about the benefits yourself, look at it from

[33:54] the family’s perspective, and you might be able to help them out as well. Cool. There’s a great program — back to that 100%: if a veteran is 100%, Chapter 35 will give their kids two to three years of college. Wow. That’s a big deal. That is a huge deal. That is awesome. Plus healthcare, you know, using CHAMPVA at this point. So with that, I would say let’s continue with this mission and help veterans as a collective group, because we can do a lot more together than we ever could individually. Dude, I love that. I love

[34:26] that. We’re better together. Way better together. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Thank you all for all that you do for veterans. Yes. Well, it’s an honor. It is a privilege. It’s a privilege to be able to treat this. An honor and a privilege. Yeah. Oh, I feel like it’s time for a game. Okay. All right. You want to play a game? Let’s go. Play a game. All right. This game is called bureaucracy. When did — it’s called bureaucracy. Bureaucracy, which I feel like they made that word hard to say on purpose,

[34:56] Right? And if I had a lisp, oh jeez, that would just be murder — which the word “lisp” isn’t good. Okay. Anyway, but it’s called bureaucracy, which is also impossible to spell. Or BS. All right. So, I have a list of military regulations, some from field manuals and whatnot. Oh, boy. And half of these are real and half of them are made up. Okay. Okay. And so we’re going to read them off and you

[35:26] just get to identify: bureaucracy or BS. Okay. Okay. All right. Very good. That’s a good practice. All right. Here we go. We’re going to start with this one. Some of these I’ve thrown in regulations with them and it might just be kind of to throw you for a loop. Sure. Sure. Let’s start with this one. The Navy’s line-crossing ceremony requires sailors to dress as various sea creatures to appease King Neptune. That is true. That is — I am Shellbacked. Yes.

[35:59] Okay. Yes. Okay. We took a Navy ship over to Iraq. Yes. And quite the experience. Okay. Good. All right. Very good. Okay. Here we go. Army regulations specify the exact number of steps to take when approaching a superior officer’s desk. Three steps. Pause. Then salute. It’s army. Maybe. Sure. Okay. You’re going to go bureaucracy on that one? I’ll go bureaucracy. It’s BS. Okay. Okay. Here we go. Members of the Navy and the Marines may wear the uniforms of

[36:30] either service branch. No. That is actually bureaucracy. What? Uh-huh. You — No. Yes. No. Yes. That one was given to me — BS on you — by a major, and they said because sometimes you’re majorly wrong. A major of what? And the circumstance was if you had a job and you needed to be attached to a Marine unit, then you could wear the Marine uniforms.

[37:02] But they said that you would probably think that it was BS because Marines would never wear the — Oh, they would never wear it. But the Navy people wear the Marine stuff when they’re attached. Yeah. I don’t know. We may have to consult Wikipedia. We’ll have to look. Wikipedia. Wikipedia is our source. We’ll put it, I guess. Yeah. Let’s — Would you write a letter to Wikipedia if that’s accurate or not? Thank you. All right. Here we go. Next one. According to an official Army field manual, soldiers are

[37:32] advised to show respect to explosive ordnance disposal robots as they are considered a part of the team. BS or bureaucracy? What? Yes. What? Yes. Their advice is show respect to your bomb robot. So what does that mean? You got to salute it. I don’t know. I have no idea. Yeah. I relied on the internet for this. So all right. Army Field Hygiene Manual FM 21-10 once advised soldiers to hum the Star-

[38:02] Spangled Banner while brushing their teeth to ensure proper oral hygiene timing under field conditions. Sure. That is BS. All right, here we go. The military outlines that if a civilian were to find a missing Apache attack helicopter, they can receive a reward of up to $500 and no less than $100 under AR 735-5. No, that is actually bureaucracy. It is

[38:32] true. Yes. But what about this one? You get $500. That’s all you get for a lost — That’s something. Yeah. Okay. Civilians locating or giving information leading to the recovery of a Tomahawk missile can receive a reward of up to $10,000 and no less than $5,000. Bureaucracy or BS? I would say BS because if something like that went missing, the whole command would be doing push-ups. It is BS. Okay. And an Apache would be the same. Yes. But the rule is that you — it’s the same as for the Apache

[39:04] helicopter — you would receive no less than $100, but no more than $500. Let’s go find some Tomahawk missiles. Yeah, we’re going to get rich. All right. A couple more here. AR 360-1. Army aviation assets are not to be used to transport persons costumed as Santa Claus, Easter Bunnies, witches, or any other holiday-related character, whether the person is military or civilian, on or off a military installation. Bureaucracy or BS? BS. Why

[39:36] not? That is bureaucracy. Yeah. Isn’t that crazy? I mean, yeah. Shoot. Okay, we’re going to do one more here. Work hard, play hard. Yeah. Work hard, play hard. The Army’s official sandwich stacking procedure specifies that condiments must be applied in a specific order. Mustard before mayo unless the sandwich is transported over 12 hours. Bureaucracy or BS? I would say bureaucracy because when we came back into Camp Cupcake, as we called it. Okay. You had a lot of army folks

[40:07] upset about the fact they had to eat eggs and steak again. So, sure. Okay. It’s actually BS. But I’ll tell you what’s not BS. You, my friend, are the real deal. Really appreciate you taking the time to talk with us. I know that I learned a lot and I thought that I already knew about it. I was like, “Oh, Kathy, let’s do this. I already know everything.” No. Yeah, this has been really informative. I want to thank you for your service. You’re one of those people I was talking about — you know, you put yourself in a position

[40:38] where you put it all on the line to protect people like me and Kathy who aren’t cool enough to go into the service. Absolutely not. So, you don’t want me on that wall? No, we want Kyle on that wall. Yeah, absolutely. But no, I think that you’re a hero. Kathy, you got anything to add to wrap it up here? No, just thank you for everything you continue to do. Especially, you know, we love to serve veterans and you making it easier for them to reach us is gift enough to us. So, thank you. Thank you

[41:08] for doing what you do. Fantastic. Okay. Well, man, I think that we said all the most important stuff. And so now we got one little item to get to. And what’s that, Kathy? There’s no — there’s no “I” in PTCH. Yeah. All right.

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